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« Condi | Main | HobbsOnline Live Recap » April 13, 2004Has the Blogosphere Grown Up? Not So Fast...Pejman Yousefsadeh's latest at TechCentralStation.com explores the flap over Daily Kos blogger Markos Moulitsas Zuniga's comment essentially cheering the deaths of four civilian contractors guarding a food convoy in Fallujah. Kos said he felt "nothing" over the deaths of the four men because they were "mercenaries" (which they weren't.) Pejman says the fact that prominent Lefty bloggers who oppose the war and hate President Bush as much or more as Kos were able to criticize Kos shows the blogosphere is growing up. The kind of debate prompted by this episode has important implications for the maturity of the Blogosphere. The latter issue deserves some attention as we continue to track the Blogosphere's growth and evolution as a new medium.Yeah, but... The Lefty blogosphere hasn't heavily criticized Sen. Chris Dodd over his racist-coddling remarks about Sen. Robert Byrd in any way close to how the Right side of the blogosphere jumped all over Sen. Trent Lott after Lott made racially insensitive remarks about Sen. Strom Thurmond. Here is what Dodd said recently while praising Sen. Byrd on the occasion of the eight-term Democrat's 17,000th Senate vote: "I do not think it is an exaggeration at all to say to my friend from West Virginia that he would have been a great senator at any moment. He would have been right at the founding of this country. He would have been in the leadership crafting this Constitution. He would have been right during the great conflict of Civil War in this nation."That's Robert Byrd, a former Klansman who used the "N" word recently on television. Most Lefty bloggers either ingnored it or defended Dodd. Is Pejman right that the blogosphere is growing up and becoming better at self-criticism? I think the Kos case is a bad example, an outlier. Kos' remarks were so egregious, so hateful, so callous toward dead Americans that even the Left's most hateful bloggers realized it was going to generate severe blowback. They had to condemn it, even if those that did condemn it often qualified their condemnation by saying Kos was substantively right though rhetorically out of bounds. But when one of their own, Sen. Dodd, says a former Klansman and unreconstructed racist would have been a great senator during the Civil War, they remain silent. The Blogosphere still has a lot of growing up to do. Posted in Blogging & Journalism
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So too, then, the leftists outside of blogdom. Posted by: Bithead at April 13, 2004 07:02 AMTCS is a lobbying group, not a blog. And you continue to misrepresent Kos' comment on the mercenaries which calls into question your honesty. Posted by: JadeGold at April 13, 2004 02:36 PMyou are THE last person on the 'net today to comment on honesty, JadeGold. The evidence is all over the 'net just how genuine you are. There is no misrepresentation of the comments made by the (D) fund-raiser, Kos. His comments were clear enough, how many ways do you read, "I feel nothing over the death of merceneries [sic]. They aren't in Iraq because of orders, or because they are there trying to help the people make Iraq a better place. They are there to wage war for profit. Screw them"? I think Kos misrepresented what these men were doing by saying they were involved in "war for profit", when the job a security agent is a far cry from being a front line soldier or Marine. Maybe you should cover it on your blog. http://jadegold.blogspot.com Posted by: jcrue at April 13, 2004 02:52 PMActually, Jade, no one said TCS was a blog. It is an online publication - an e-magazine if you will, with a variety of contributing authors who are not lobbyists at all. It has a general point-of-view, sure. But so does The New Republic. Posted by: Bill Hobbs at April 13, 2004 03:29 PMBill: The Right has its darlings, too, like Andrew Sullivan (and here, and especially here). Posted by: Michael Williams at April 13, 2004 04:18 PMI see one of my devoted fans has saw fit to repost Kos' comment: "I feel nothing over the death of merceneries. They aren't in Iraq because of orders, or because they are there trying to help the people make Iraq a better place. They are there to wage war for profit. Screw them" And, for the record, Mr. Hobb's comment: Daily Kos blogger Markos Moulitsas Zuniga's comment essentially cheering the deaths of four civilian contractors", My emphasis added to highlight Mr. Hobb's dishonesty. Mr. Hobbs claims Kos was "cheering" the deaths--yet, thanks to my stalker, we see Kos' words were that he "felt nothing." 'felt nothing' certainly doesn't equal 'cheering.' I see my little pilotfish also objects to the correct use of the word "mercenaries." As a vet, I understand this is the correct terminology to describe those killed in Fallujah. BTW, many other vets and/or rightwingers understand "mercenaries" is the correct word: Posted by: JadeGold at April 13, 2004 05:10 PMJadie, put a sock in it. Nope, Art 47 (d), I quote "(d) is neither a national of a Party to the conflict nor a resident of territory controlled by a Party to the conflict;" This says that if the "mercenary" is a member of one of the conflicted parties (ie. the US is a conflicted party and they were US citizens), then they are not classified as mercenaries. Even with that, the 4 CIVILIAN CONTRACTORS were tricked by ICDC personnel (maybe false ones) into going thru Fallujah. They were promised a safe way and once into the city, the ICDC blocked off the street and the ambush killed them. On other news. How about this new bigot eruption from KoS site. His site just made a completey offensive remark about Colin Powell. http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/4/12/183155/559 I quote, "Yes suh! Yes suh! Right away suh!" I don't know why Bill doesn't ban you. You add nothing, NOTHING, to discussions here. You are some perverse left wing echo chamber. Bill, do us all a favor and dump this guy, yee gads. Posted by: capt joe at April 13, 2004 07:11 PMThey're mercenaries, Joey. Plain and simple. BTW, I'm hearing a lot from US servicemen who say these mercenaries are causing more problems than they are helping. Posted by: JadeGold at April 13, 2004 07:57 PMGoldie So do you receive these transmissions from your tinfoil hat. Good model, you must have paid top dollar for that one. It must be the same one you got your bogus AWOL crap from. ;) Did you even bother reading the articles you quoted. Eugene Volokh didn't call them mercenaries. He used "mercenaries" with scare quotes. The same ones Reuters uses when they want to say bs. Peter Singer never mentions the word mercenary even once in his article. James Joyner later posits that he is not sure of their status. The agonist calls them mercenaries. You quoted 4 articles. 2 do no call them mercenaries, one is not sure, the other is. What a load of cow manure. Posted by: capt joe at April 13, 2004 08:14 PMwhat no rejoinder on KoS's racist remarks. By your remarkable standards, then you must agree with them. So are you going to do the right thing and say it's wrong. How about Gary Trudeau calling Condi Brown sugar. What say you there? I've banned half a dozen IP addressess associated with JadeGold (The "Gold" stands for "Gold Standard for Idiocy"). I think he just goes to the mall and uses the various PCs at the Dell and Comcast cable kiosks or something. Or maybe he works at a Gateway outlet. If JG goes silent when they close their retail stores, we'll know that's the case. In the meantime, he does a very good job showing just how stupid many on the Left are. Posted by: Bill Hobbs at April 13, 2004 09:45 PMI thought it was a particularly powerful form of asiatic heroin. That would explain the semantic and rhetorical content ;) Posted by: capt joe@eat.com at April 13, 2004 09:54 PMAre you doing full IP-banning, or do you just ban the specific address? Also, JG has discovered anonymizers. Shocking, I know. Ban them, too. Posted by: Slartibartfast at April 13, 2004 09:55 PMHold on now, guys. Yes, Jade is mind-numbingly frustrating, willfully ignorant, close-minded, arrogant, dishonest (extremely so), slanderous, obnoxious and more partisan than ANY individual I've ever heard from, but I think he serves a purpose. I get a kick out of the many rational voices on this blog that continue to refute his claims and *ideas* and then watching him resort to slander and lies attempting to defend his positions. Once his stances are obliterated JDAM-like, he scurries off like a cockroach to the next topic. I think it's important for us to see how the other side thinks (in his case, doesn't). Jade is not an isolated basketcase...he's representative of many out there who actively root against America while convincing themselves they do not. Although I'm not sure exactly how or why, I think Jade serves a purpose. Banning him won't make his particular psychosis go away. I say let him keep trolling, and let the truth keep trying to set his mind free! Sen. Byrd would have made a wonderful Senator during the Civil War, a Confederate Senator! Posted by: nobody important at April 16, 2004 11:17 AMPost a comment
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