Just = Another Pretty=20 Farce

Datta Dayadhvam Damyata Shantih Shantih=20 Shantih

27 February, 2007

J.L. Kirk & Associates: My Story

Feel free to skip to the end for the = juicy=20 stuff...

JL = Kirk &=20 Associates found my husband's resume online. They contacted him a = couple of=20 weeks ago and offered their services as an 'Executive Placement Firm'. = As I'm=20 wont to do, I of course Googled them as much as possible and found very = little=20 in the way of solid information. So I've decided to write up our = experiences=20 with them for anyone else who is interested in finding out more about = this=20 particular operation.

Anyone who has been searching for a job = for any=20 length of time is well aware of the various vulnerabilities that are = part of the=20 process. There's the self-doubt, frustration and impatience, coupled = with no=20 small amount of worry. So when a job searcher gets an email that says = "maybe we=20 can help!" the relief is almost immediate.

My husband filled out = an=20 application and questionnaire, and returned it directly to the company. = He then=20 received an appointment with a counselor the following week. During that = appointment the representative of JL Kirk & Associates interviewed = him just=20 as one would for a position. The afternoon after the interview he = received an=20 email that congratulated him on making it through the first step of the = process.=20 They wanted to schedule a second interview which required my presence as = a=20 Support Person/Spouse/Significant Other. When he scheduled the interview = he=20 questioned them directly about their fees and payment arrangements. He = was told=20 that if we received approval after the second interview the money would = be=20 discussed at that time.

So today was the second interview, and = we drove=20 to Maryland Farms for our 2:00 appointment. We sat in a waiting room = next to a=20 fake fireplace and a lone man in a suit. At 2:11 a matronly woman came = out and=20 announced to the other man--in front of us--that she would not be = able to=20 meet with him because he wasn't able to bring his Support Person. They = had a=20 lengthy conversation in front of us about this failed meeting and his=20 disappointment. He asked to speak with her behind closed doors (as would = I) and=20 then five minutes later that conversation ended with him leaving = dejectedly. She=20 then turned to us (it is now 2:17pm) and greeted us warmly.

We = were led=20 into an office that appeared to have been the result of a decorating war = between=20 a loan officer and an eccentric grandmother. The prototypical office = furniture=20 clashed with a giant print of Raffael's=20 Cherubs a reproduction oriental rug and a handmade mosaic table with = a=20 tilted top. The Husband and I were seated in two chairs across from the=20 interviewer, who sat on a sofa next to a pile of throw pillows. =

Here's=20 where the fun starts. We heard all about how hard it is to find a job, = how most=20 jobs aren't posted online and are only found through networking. We = heard about=20 how the really good jobs are available only to those 'in the know' and = can only=20 be obtained through some wizardy combining Masonic handshakes, good = dentistry=20 and whatever pixie dust this particular company stores in the backroom. = This=20 interview seemed very carefully designed to exploit every potential=20 vulnerability that any jobseeker feels. After about 10 minutes of = conversation subtly designed to push every button we may have, the = interviewer=20 handed us a booklet that was said to be a tailored write-up of my = husband's=20 profile as a job-seeker. The interviewer left us alone in the room to = digest the=20 booklet on our own terms.

The booklet consisted of three pages = of=20 reiteration of the interview's strong-arm tactics, followed by a = regurgitation=20 of information from my husband's resume, all summarised with a couple of = pages=20 essentially saying "the job market is tough but we think you're = really=20 great and so we'll be here to help you get a job!" We skimmed the = booklet and=20 reviewed our game plan, then signaled the interviewer by opening the=20 door.

Our game plan was to ask direct questions about the = company's=20 operation and placement record. In short, 'what exactly do you do and = how well=20 do you do it?' We had test answers in mind. In short, if we ask a direct = question and get a vague answer such as "every case is different so = numbers are=20 hard to apply here" that tells us a great deal about the company's = services.=20

Sure enough, our first question about placement rate was = answered with=20 an "every case is different, etc." style answer. Ultimately she gave us = the=20 figure of "90 to 92% placement rate" and then proceeded to tell us a = long tale=20 about a 'failed' client who showed up 37 minutes late to an interview = with a CEO=20 from an out-of-state firm. We all agreed that was indeed very = unprofessional of=20 said client and what a shame and how good to not work with him. (I of = course was=20 thinking about how we were on time for that interview which she = failed to=20 start until 17 minutes after the promised appointment time.)

She = then=20 gave us the very good news that they were prepared to accept us as = clients. Then=20 the fun began. We were told that Headhunters and Employment Agencies = took fees=20 only when a job had been secured for the job seeker, and they took their = fees=20 (generally 30-40%) from the hiring firm. But that means the job seeker = gets a=20 lower starting salary because all of their good money is going to the=20 headhunter/employment agency. Thankfully, though, JL Kirk & = Associates will=20 be able to get my husband a job making a far larger starting salary. All = we need=20 to do is put $4,420 on a credit card today. Once we do that the entire = weight of=20 the firm of JL Kirk & Associates will begin the task of navigating=20 treacherous shark-infested landmines of the job search on behalf of my = husband.=20 And just trust them, because they find jobs for 90% of the people who = pay them=20 to.

So that's how it works. And that's pretty much how we = expected that=20 it would work. But both the spouse and I believe that it's = irrepsonsible=20 to not pursue any lead during this time so we thought we'd go through = the=20 process. Especially since they kept so much of it in the dark from the = outset.=20

JUICY STUFF BEGINS HERE
But I'm very angry about it. = If you've=20 made it this far, I suppose maybe you could tell that I've been = supressing most=20 of my irritation. However, irritation makes for good blog reading, and = so here=20 it is.

I get really ticked off at people trying to use fear to = motivate=20 others. I don't care if you are a fire-and-brimstone preacher, an = insurance=20 salesman, a used-car salesman or a cat burglar. Finding someone else's = fear and=20 vulnerability and using that vulnerability to somehow enrich yourself is = a cheap=20 and underhanded tactic. It's wrong and it's cruel. And I think that's = exactly=20 what this placement firm did to us today. There were times when I felt = like I=20 was sitting across from a spider. We were meant to feel at home enough = to let=20 down our guard so that the woman could then ply us gently with tales of = terror.=20 All of it was designed to make us hand over nearly $5,000 without = question and=20 without possibility of a refund.

The husband and I are not = always=20 idiots. We both expect to pay for services rendered from any provider. = But we=20 generally like to be treated as responsible adults. We had legitimate = questions=20 about the fee structure and we raised those at several points in the = process.=20 For them to not even discuss that fee structure until they had battered = us=20 emotionally for half an hour is what I would consider to be unethical. = I'm sure=20 there are other employment agencies and headhunters out there. We'll = continue to=20 look for them.

In the meantime, I would discourage anyone who = stumbles=20 across this entry from even going through the JL Kirk & Associates=20 "interview process".

UPDATE

I should also mention = that this=20 company was formerly Bernard = Haldane=20 before it was purchased by Mr. Kirk Leipzig. One of the accusations = against=20 Bernard Haldane was that they would make an examination of the potential = client's assets and charge accordingly. I find it interesting to note = just how=20 close our "fee" was to the tax refund we recently received. Hmmm. Makes = you=20 wonder, no?

posted by Kat Coble @ 11:04=20 PM 37=20 comments

37 Comments:

At 1:38=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Lynnster said...=20: Gosh. The part about HAVING to bring your spouse/support person = with you=20 made me edgy first, then when I got to the "All we need to do is put = $4,420 on=20 a credit card today" part my heart just sank.

I agree with you = two's=20 take that it would be irresponsible not to pursue all options and I = know=20 things are so tough right now. I am really hating you both had to go = through=20 this experience though, the tale really gives me the creeps, I hope = things=20 turn out okay VERY soon.

Continuing to send good karma your way = and=20 keep y'all in prayers.
=20
At 6:32=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Slartibartfast said...=20: Damn.

This post makes me so angry, I swear I could resort to = violence.

But then, I realise that this post will show up on a = lot of=20 Google searches. Much better than violence.

However, I still = want to=20 call Turko.
=20
At 6:49=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Sarcastro said...=20: Morons.

If only there was someone to warn you of such=20 = scams...
http://sarcastro.squarespace.com/journal/2006/7/26/the-big-st= ore.html
=20
At 6:50=20 AM, February 28, 2007, newscoma said...=20: I'm with Slartibartfast on this.
These "employment" are = destroying=20 northwest Tennessee.
It makes me so damned angry I can't = think.
=20
At 7:58=20 AM, February 28, 2007, nm = said...=20: You actually had a better experience than I was afraid of when I = read the=20 "you must bring your spouse" part. I was afraid you'd get home to find = that=20 thieves had cleared out your house.
=20
At 8:20=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Kat=20 Coble said...=20: Lynnster, thanks. I've really no doubt that things will turn out = okay in=20 the long run, and I thought this was pretty educational. Thanks for = the=20 prayers. We continue to need them.

Slarti--

With Google, = sites=20 that are updated more frequently usually appear very high in the = search=20 rankings, even if they're updated on a different topic. Because of = that, this=20 blog tends to have a very high placement in Google. Generally when I = write an=20 entry it comes in the top 5 for any search on the subject after a week = or so.=20 That's EXACTLY the one reason I wrote this entry. I'm pretty confident = that=20 anyone searching for either J.L. Kirk or JL Kirk will get this story = on the=20 TOP of their search pile.

Which is why I wish Sarcastro had = used the=20 name of the company (it's the same one, judging by the fake fireplace) = in HIS=20 blog entry. Dude, that would really have helped, because I did read it = back in=20 the day, but it didn't show up on my googling.

nc--
I spent = most of=20 last evening at alternating levels of angry. I decided that my best = recourse=20 was to first do this write-up for the Web and then contact the State's = Attorney General. Since we didn't actually spend any money we may not = be a=20 valid complainant according to the AG's office, but I think we have = enough to=20 warrant a registered complaint based on deceptive business practices,=20 misrepresentation and fraud. I find the fact that the amount we were = asked to=20 pay so neatly coincides with our tax refund (which is a matter of = public=20 record) very suspicious.

nm,
I hadn't actually thought about = that=20 one. Given the way these crooks operated it wouldn't have surprised = me,=20 though. Hubs thinks I'm a bit nuts but I asked the interviewer = flat-out if the=20 turn down of the other guy in the lobby was staged for our benefit. It = seemed=20 like the kind of thing con artists like these would do.

In = doing more=20 reading about these clowns I found a couple places where it is alleged = that=20 the "JL" in JL Kirk actually stands for "Jesus is Lord". That really = burns my=20 butter.
=20
At 8:52=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Kerry=20 Woo said...=20: I'm curious to know if bringing a spouse/support person was = designed to=20 have the second person apply "pressure" framed in a question such as = "You do=20 want your husband to succeed right?"

In this case, having your = support=20 and additional discernment only made things better - and it's always = good to=20 have a extra person to sniff out a con... hang in there!

The = best is=20 just around the corner; stay strong; honorable people act honorably = and stand=20 firm for what is honorable. I'm praying for a great outcome!
=20
At 8:56=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Ivy,=20 the Great and Powerful said...=20: I suspect the having the support person there is to make it harder = for the=20 person to sue when they don't find them a job.

I'm sorry you = had such=20 a crappy experience, those people are bastards.
=20
At 8:58=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Kat=20 Coble said...=20: Kerry & Ivy, you're both right.

There were questions = directed at=20 me designed to help me as the insecure wife put more economic pressure = on The=20 Husband. Didn't work. I'm proud of the husband and not all that = frightened. I=20 WAS mad that they tried to pull that tactic, though. Like he's not = under=20 enough stress already.

And there's also the obvious legality of = our not=20 having an out with the credit card company to dispute the = charges.
=20
At 9:33=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Malia said...=20: The "support person" scenario is a sleazy recruiting tactic. MLM's = like=20 Amway do it all the time. If the person they are recruiting is=20 married/engaged/in a long-term relationship, they try to get the = recruit to=20 sign their significant other up as well and be "partners". Or they try = the=20 scare tactics by making sure the significant other knows just how much = potential the recruit has and if they don't support them then they are = destined to fail. We had a disturbing experience with that at the = beginning of=20 our marriage. I can't really give details because the recruiters in = question=20 are also family members and I don't want to embarrass them on the=20 Internet!

I'm so glad you went through the interview and = sniffed them=20 out and then posted about it. Undoubtedly it will help countless = others out=20 there who are being "recruited" by them!
=20
At 9:35=20 AM, February 28, 2007, ceeelcee said...=20: If they thought bringing the "support person" along would make you = all=20 easier to intimidate, methinks they = miscalculated.

Fuggem.
=20
At 9:42=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Kat=20 Coble said...=20: I really don't think they reckoned on the dread coupling of an=20 organisational analyst and a poker-playing skeptic.
=20
At 9:54=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Slartibartfast said...=20: I've got people
=20
At 10:33=20 AM, February 28, 2007, Lesley=20 said...=20: In doing more reading about these clowns I found a couple places = where=20 it is alleged that the "JL" in JL Kirk actually stands for "Jesus is = Lord".=20 That really burns my butter.

My thought was that he = inverted his=20 name/initials so it sounded less ethnic (for lack of a better term). = Either=20 way, it's sleazy. I hate people who use Jesus as a marketing = tool.
=20
At 12:55=20 PM, February 28, 2007, Exador said...=20: Reputable headhunting firms are paid by the employer. As you have=20 discovered, anybody that wants money from the employee is scamming=20 you.
=20
At 4:26=20 PM, February 28, 2007, Sarcastro said...=20: Perhaps "morons" was too harsh.

I linked to them, rather = than naming=20 them, because they didn't actually put the arm on me for money. After = the=20 "bring your Special Other" directive, I figured it was a scam and = decided not=20 to go back for the part where they try to separate me from my=20 money.

Plus, Paramount has their legal team enforcing a ruling = that=20 says I can't use the nam "Kirk" without their written = consent.
=20
At 4:56=20